In this episode of Innovators Inside Podcast, Ian Bergman sits down with Dr. Hisham Alasad, Head of Innovation Enablement at Qatar Airways, to unpack a simple but powerful idea: innovation should serve people first. From open banking and data ownership to AI agents and a practical Responsible Innovation framework, this conversation is built for founders, operators, and innovation leaders who want to ship meaningful change without being reckless.

Here are the five key takeaways from their conversation:

1. Open Banking Shifts Power to the Customer, not the Bank

Open banking sounds technical, but the outcome is straightforward: customers should be able to share their financial data with whoever they choose, safely and easily.

The mechanism is standardized APIs that allow banks to exchange data with other banks and approved third parties like fintechs. The point is not “more tech.” The point is more competition, more innovation, and more consumer choice.

Practical lesson for operators: If your business depends on customer trust, do not build moats out of friction. The market eventually punishes lock-in. Build loyalty through value.

2. Banks Respond in Predictable Patterns, and Each Creates Opportunity for Fintech

One of the most useful parts of the episode is Hisham’s breakdown of how incumbent banks react when open banking becomes real. Not all banks fight it the same way.

Many fall into one of these paths:

• Wait and see (often a slow decline)

• Distributor model (use fintech capabilities, deliver them to customers)

• Manufacturer model (build products, rely on partners for distribution)

• Platform model (strip down to license, compliance, KYC, and become a marketplace)

Each model creates openings for founders. If a bank becomes a distributor, fintechs can become the product engine. If a bank becomes a manufacturer, fintechs can become the distribution layer. If a bank becomes a platform, the ecosystem expands fast.

Practical lesson for founders: Track what incumbents are becoming, not what they are today. Your go-to-market changes depending on whether you are selling product, distribution, or infrastructure.

3. Open Finance is the Next Wave, but it Depends on Digital Identity

Open banking is the starting point. The bigger move is open finance, where the same data sharing logic expands beyond banks into insurance, investments, retirement accounts, and more.

The constraint is not ambition. It’s infrastructure. Hisham highlights a key requirement many founders underestimate: digital identity. Without a reliable way to prove “this person is who they say they are,” secure data exchange at national scale becomes much harder.

Countries with strong digital identity systems tend to unlock smoother experiences across finance, healthcare, travel, and government services.

Practical lesson for builders: If your product touches regulated data, map the identity layer early. It will shape onboarding, fraud risk, compliance cost, and partnership speed.

4.  Innovation is Overcoming Fear, and Fear Often Hides Behind “Risk” and “Regulation”

Hisham offers a definition that cuts through corporate theater: innovation is overcoming fear.

At the edge of change, you face real uncertainty: failure, wasted budget, reputational risk, and resistance from stakeholders who prefer the status quo. Many teams do not say “I’m scared.” They say “legal will not like it” or “risk will never approve this.”

Sometimes those concerns are real. Sometimes they are camouflage.

Practical lesson for innovation leaders: Name the fear in the room. Then design a safer experiment. Small pilots, clear guardrails, and measurable learning goals turn fear into forward motion.

5. Responsible Innovation is a Framework You Can Run Like a Checklist

The most actionable part of the conversation is Hisham’s push to extend the logic of “responsible AI” into innovation itself. His Responsible Innovation approach centers on building innovation that is:

• Scalable

• Ethical

• Inclusive

• Beneficial to society, not only the balance sheet

Key components discussed in the episode include:

• Purpose alignment: Align business goals with human outcomes. Who benefits? Who is left behind?
  
  
• Open ecosystem: Partner with startups, universities, and research institutes. Closed innovation moves slower.
  
  
• Governance: Innovation without governance becomes chaos. Think bias, monitoring, and course correction.
  
  
• Expanded ROI: Measure traditional ROI plus ESG impact.
  
  
• Scalability: If it cannot scale, it risks becoming theater.

Practical lesson for executives: Use this as a pre-launch filter. If the innovation cannot pass purpose, governance, and scalability, it is not ready.

The episode closes with a line worth repeating: innovation is not about speed, it is about direction. For leaders building products, platforms, or transformations, direction comes from a human-first lens and a willingness to challenge systems that keep people stuck.

If you are working on fintech, data platforms, AI workflows, or corporate innovation programs, this conversation will give you language, structure, and a north star you can apply immediately.

Have a question for a future guest? Email us at innovators@alchemistaccelerator.com to get in touch! 

Timestamps

🍫 00:00:00 Welcome Hisham Alasad

🧠 00:04:32 The one skill future leaders cannot skip: emotional intelligence

🤖 00:06:49 AI as a permanent teammate, plus the keyboard vs voice bet

⚡ 00:13:16 Tech progress vs fragile infrastructure and reliability

🌍 00:17:10 Why Hisham moved to Qatar and how he avoids “comfort zone stagnation”

🏦 00:19:25 Open banking explained: data ownership, APIs, and breaking bank lock-in

🧾 00:23:08 How banks react to open banking: wait and see, distributor, manufacturer, or platform

🧍 00:31:08 Open finance and why digital identity is a key prerequisite

🔮 00:34:34 The “Holy Trinity” prediction: open data + AI + quantum computing by ~2030

😨 00:36:27 Why innovation is overcoming fear (and how fear hides behind “risk” and “regulation”)

🧭 00:39:36 The Responsible Innovation framework: purpose alignment, open ecosystems, governance, ESG ROI, scalability

✈️ 00:47:31 Banking vs aviation: the shared foundation is trust

🕊️ 00:49:18 “AI for Peace”: a vision to build a Silicon Valley of the Middle East

🧩 00:52:09 Closing lesson: innovation is not about speed, it’s about direction

Full Transcript

00:01:05:19 - 00:01:07:10
Ian Bergman
Good evening. It's good to see you.

00:01:07:15 - 00:01:12:03
Hisham Alasad
Hello. Thanks, Ian. Yeah, thanks for having me. Great to be here.

00:01:12:05 - 00:01:25:24
Ian Bergman
Oh. It's great. It's great to have you here. Welcome to Innovators Inside. Last time I saw you was in a room in Doha. And now we're kind of facing each other across the screen. So it's. I'm really excited to have you on the pod.

00:01:26:02 - 00:01:45:00
Hisham Alasad
Thank you very much. And I'm couldn't be happier being on this podcast. You know why? Because, I'm a big believer that innovation should serve people first. And I was that it should connect communities, reduce barriers and create opportunities. And your podcast is actually a representation of that. So I thank you for having me.

00:01:45:07 - 00:02:08:24
Ian Bergman
Oh, amazing. Well, I'll take a guest's like complimenting me before we've even gotten started. We're going to see if you're still saying nice things at the end. No, no, it's it's absolutely wonderful. And, you know, for for folks who don't know him, I'm just so thrilled that, doctor Hisham Asad has joined us today. I've had the chance to work with him, see him in action.

00:02:08:27 - 00:02:25:14
Ian Bergman
We have a thought leader in innovation joining us on the pod, so I can't wait to hear what what you have to say. But before we dig in, I like to play a little bit of a game, and so I'm. I'm going to ask you just a few questions, and I don't want you to think too much.

00:02:25:15 - 00:02:28:10
Ian Bergman
I just want you to answer with whatever's off the top of the doc.

00:02:28:12 - 00:02:29:29
Hisham Alasad
Okay, here we go.

00:02:30:01 - 00:02:38:03
Ian Bergman
I'm good. And let's start with what's a guilty pleasure app or tool that you can't live without?

00:02:38:05 - 00:02:41:06
Hisham Alasad
Chocolate after 8 p.m.. Absolutely.

00:02:41:09 - 00:02:42:17
Ian Bergman
Oh, what is it?

00:02:42:19 - 00:02:44:24
Hisham Alasad
I love eating chocolate after 8 p.m..

00:02:44:26 - 00:02:48:09
Ian Bergman
Yeah. Okay. So you just like that is like your brain food.

00:02:48:15 - 00:03:03:02
Hisham Alasad
You just. Yeah. Just do it. It's 8 a.m.. I have chocolate. And at the start, because, you know, I supervised researchers at university, so, you know, I have to read a lot. I take my hat off, chocolate and start working. So,

00:03:03:04 - 00:03:09:24
Ian Bergman
Okay, so I, I love it. So this might answer the next question, but are you a morning person or a night owl? Where do your best ideas come?

00:03:09:25 - 00:03:18:00
Hisham Alasad
I am an early bird. Usually I'm at my office at 630. I wake up at 530, go for my run, have my coffee and start my day.

00:03:18:02 - 00:03:24:04
Ian Bergman
Oh, incredible. Okay, well, coffee in the morning, chocolate in the evening. You're burning both ends.

00:03:24:07 - 00:03:39:01
Hisham Alasad
But I'll tell you. I'll tell you why. Why is that? If you. If you're interested. Why I have this, tell me about, When I was doing my doctorate, you know, I was a dad. I have a full time job, so I have a family. I've got work and study to look after. Well, almost 3 or 4 years.

00:03:39:07 - 00:03:54:22
Hisham Alasad
I did not sleep more than five, four hours a night. And that's because I work at 5 or 4 a.m., try to squeeze two hours to study before I go to work. Go to work in the family so that the kids go to work, come back to the family, and then study from 8 to 11 and sleep for five hours.

00:03:54:25 - 00:03:57:03
Hisham Alasad
That was for 3 or 4 weeks. Yeah.

00:03:57:05 - 00:04:13:25
Ian Bergman
That's unreal. I mean, I got to tell you, as somebody who feels like is needed eight, nine hours of sleep every night for his entire life, I, I struggle with this. I really struggle with this. But good on you know, I kid you are. I know you are entitled to your chocolate habit.

00:04:13:27 - 00:04:18:15
Hisham Alasad
I did not have enough shit, right? Yeah. Thank you very much.

00:04:18:18 - 00:04:32:18
Ian Bergman
All right. I want to go a little deeper. You know, you're very thoughtful about the present and the future. What is one skill that leaders in the future absolutely have to master?

00:04:32:21 - 00:04:57:17
Hisham Alasad
Quite funny. I was having, dinner with my friends two nights ago at a cafe here called Flamingo. We were watching the the, the soccer game between Lebanon and Sudan. So they are. There is now a tournament in Qatar called the Arab Cup. And there's a there's the qualifiers now. And we were just talking, chit chatting. And I did mention that the skill that stays with you for life is that emotional intelligence.

00:04:57:19 - 00:05:18:03
Hisham Alasad
It's our duty to teach our kids how to be emotionally intelligent, how to be socially accepted when they go into the playground when they are 3 or 4 years old. They need to know how to interact, how to play. So even the grownups ourselves, when you see you see social kid, you just love them by nature, right? And they go to school, they're able to form friendships at school.

00:05:18:06 - 00:05:30:18
Hisham Alasad
They go to the real life. They able to do like professional relationships as well. They able to communicate. They go into leadership. They go into, marriage. And everything is the emotional intelligence and the social skills. That's my.

00:05:30:18 - 00:05:56:27
Ian Bergman
Answer. You know what? I think it's a great answer. And you know, what I love about that answer is, I don't think that's all that different from what the leaders of the past have had to master, right? Like we are humans, we are a network of people who need to interact with each other. And, you know, there I feel like in this world of what feels like constant change in some ways that feels consistent to me and important.

00:05:56:28 - 00:06:00:04
Ian Bergman
It is a North star for how we succeed in life.

00:06:00:06 - 00:06:13:26
Hisham Alasad
I think it's a it's another start for the human race to be honest about whether you are east, west, north or south. It doesn't matter. You need to be able to communicate and feel loved and spread love is pretty simple for me.

00:06:13:26 - 00:06:31:16
Ian Bergman
I, you know, I, I completely agree and you would be super happy to know that in the conversations that I've had with my wife about our young children, this is her number one priority as well. She's much smarter than I am. So I listen to everything she says. And it makes sense. So thank you for sharing that.

00:06:31:18 - 00:06:33:18
Hisham Alasad
Please pass my greetings to a lovely wife.

00:06:33:19 - 00:06:49:10
Ian Bergman
I absolutely I absolutely. Well, all right, actually going to ask you one more. I need also I need, like a super short answer to this, I friend foe or something else.

00:06:49:13 - 00:07:07:15
Hisham Alasad
It is a friend that we have no choice of saying otherwise. It is. It is here to stay well, and it's better to accept and accommodate and adapt to the existence of AI for the end of a human race. It is here to say.

00:07:07:17 - 00:07:18:15
Ian Bergman
I, I, I okay, so I'm inclined to agree with you, although at first that gives almost Terminator vibes, which is not what you're saying, right? You're not like, oh, like we'd better make it a friend or it's going to get us.

00:07:18:19 - 00:07:23:07
Hisham Alasad
It's not us. It's become. It becomes part of the family.

00:07:23:10 - 00:07:27:29
Ian Bergman
Yeah, okay. It's the exchange student that moved in and won't live.

00:07:28:01 - 00:07:45:18
Hisham Alasad
It is. It is. The robot is the brain in that robot that you and I would have in 10 or 15 years? Whether we like it or not, to do our chores, it will become part of our life. You know, it's quite funny. It's just haven't said the other day it's not very far in the future. I'm assuming that's five, ten years.

00:07:45:18 - 00:08:17:00
Hisham Alasad
Maybe the keyboard will disappear. So our, our our our our interaction with laptops and computers will be completely different. So the next evolution in human technology would be speech to text. So that's where the AI comes. You're going to wake up with mid morning talking to AI agents that check your emails and are the agent that does checks the power, the sustainability, the carbon emission, other agents to check that you report it to your boss and all of that will be like I it kind of lifestyle.

00:08:17:07 - 00:08:34:18
Ian Bergman
You know what I'm inclined to agree with you, but because I'm an argumentative type, I'm going to make a gentleman's bet with you right now. A little handshake. I bet that, you said five, ten years. I bet ten years from now, the keyboard is still a part of everyday life.

00:08:34:21 - 00:08:35:17
Hisham Alasad


00:08:35:20 - 00:08:38:00
Ian Bergman
We. You take that bet for a handshake.

00:08:38:03 - 00:08:55:09
Hisham Alasad
Okay? This is me, I go back, I mean, typewriters, they disappeared, but there is still some of them. Some people use them. Is that the kind of writers that. Yeah, I is that is that what you refer to, like just a bunch or you talking about they still there hasn't been.

00:08:55:11 - 00:09:12:03
Ian Bergman
Typewriters didn't disappear. Typewriters evolved their role, their role in our world changed. But, you know, both of us interact with a keyboard modeled on the keyboard of typewriters, in fact, designed after, the physical layout of typewriter keyboards every day.

00:09:12:06 - 00:09:24:02
Hisham Alasad
Okay, so 28th of November, 2035, I say that we will be using special text, capabilities and you say will be a keyboard. So let's say happy.

00:09:24:03 - 00:09:46:22
Ian Bergman
Let's go, let's go. The shakeout. Yep. Okay. Wonderful I love this to be to be very clear, I believe there will be both. And I believe speech to text may be the majority of our interaction. But, you know, it's really interesting because and this is kind of, the topic of innovation and something you and I have talked about, which is that, you know, often it comes with sort of behavior changes.

00:09:46:24 - 00:10:16:28
Ian Bergman
I spent a lot of time in hardware. And, you know, there's always these questions when you get these technology enabled shifts, you know, touch screens, voice gestures, whatever it might be. What will they replace. And in my experience, they almost never replace a prior input modality. They they may reduce it. But, you know, keyboards didn't replace handwriting.

00:10:17:05 - 00:10:38:29
Ian Bergman
They do reduced handwriting dramatically, but they didn't replace it. They actually opened up a whole new set of typing, I think. I think that's going to be voice for me. I think I think voice and the fact that we have AI systems and agents that can not only transcribe what we're doing, but, understand that reason on it and take action on it.

00:10:39:01 - 00:10:50:23
Ian Bergman
Yeah, I do actually think it's going to take over the majority of our compute interaction. But I think part of that is because it's going to make a larger percentage of our life a compute interaction. If that. Does that actually make sense?

00:10:50:25 - 00:11:12:18
Hisham Alasad
I tend to agree they will not replace their will complement and elevate. Yeah. This all the new capabilities. They come suddenly, especially in the hardware sphere. They show up in our life and they just the they take the majority of the what they call the shoes of our interactions with that kind of, capability. But they do not fully replace you.

00:11:12:18 - 00:11:18:20
Hisham Alasad
Right. Is it because we are humans that we are holders and we just do not let go? Think about it, that.

00:11:18:22 - 00:11:35:28
Ian Bergman
I mean, it might be we might just hang on, you know, the counter argument would be that, you know, there's a right there's the right modality for the right action, the right tool for the right job. And the more tools we get, the more options we have on which tool to use in different moments. I don't know, but but I'm looking forward to this.

00:11:35:28 - 00:11:50:21
Ian Bergman
I'm going to put in my calendar 2035. We're going to we're going to reconnect and we're going to, you know, assuming we're not all like LinkedIn to Elon Musk's Neuralink and just talking to each other through telepathy, we're going to see we're going to see how this goes.

00:11:50:23 - 00:12:12:20
Hisham Alasad
I think, you know, Elon Musk is a good guy. He thinks about humanity. He's got his own way of looking at things. People do not understand what he's talking about. But the thing is, if you notice, Ian, the more you understand technology and its impact, like we start, what's the technology impact of myself and my family on my team, on my organizations.

00:12:12:22 - 00:12:32:02
Hisham Alasad
But as we develop and mature in our thinking, we see how technology actually impacts the human race. And this is why all these big thinkers or millionaires and billionaires, they still going about humankind. Lens. I like to talk about the lens. I'm not a billionaire. I'm not the smartest. But I speak from that lens.

00:12:32:04 - 00:12:52:27
Ian Bergman
You know what? I love that, and I think it's so, you were talking just a second ago about an important skill and empathy and and understanding other people. I mean, you were sort of talking about it in social skills and being able to interact, but there's a piece of this of being able to put yourself in other people's shoes.

00:12:53:00 - 00:13:16:18
Ian Bergman
And you also, you just demonstrated that actually, which is really cool. And I think a lesson for all of us, a really important lesson actually. Thank you. I'm going to leave that there like that. That was cool. And hey, since this is a conversation, you may notice lights changing on my side, things like that. We just lost power, so I have backup systems.

00:13:16:21 - 00:13:22:09
Ian Bergman
We're going to continue the pod, but if I disappear, I'll be back.

00:13:22:11 - 00:13:29:09
Hisham Alasad
So you lost power on the morning of Thanksgiving Day. What? This is for what's Black Friday?

00:13:29:09 - 00:13:49:00
Ian Bergman
Too many people shopping. You know, who knows? Who knows what's going on? But but, you know, this is one of those things. Okay? So, like, we live in a world of of AI and magic and all these capabilities. And yet, one of the things that is always funny to me is that it feels like basic infrastructure is getting more fragile.

00:13:49:03 - 00:14:12:14
Ian Bergman
Right? And so there's more and more power outages. And obviously that's a big conversation these days. Do we even have enough power for the world? And the answer is no, it seems. But but even things like, you know, the reliability of phone calls we can have across continents, this incredible video chat right now. And yet, technically, it's not actually as reliable as picking up a phone 50 years ago.

00:14:12:17 - 00:14:20:05
Ian Bergman
Right on my landline and placing a call. And I think that's kind of I don't know what that is. I think it's pretty fascinating.

00:14:20:07 - 00:14:40:01
Hisham Alasad
But it is fascinating. And again, I'm coming to things kind of quickly. Just talk about randomly. You talked about Black Friday. I noticed in Qatar they call it the White Friday. And I asked, why is that? And apparently because Friday is a holiday in the Islamic faith. And they cannot just associate the black to it. So they say the White Friday.

00:14:40:02 - 00:15:02:04
Hisham Alasad
What that just means here in Doha is the White Friday. So talking about Black Friday, why Friday? Other thing. And we were just I was at the word mobile World Congress confirmed seeing Doha a few days ago. Right. And we just having a chat about a drone. And they've been told that the newly equipped drones in the Russian Ukrainian war, they not actually wireless anymore.

00:15:02:06 - 00:15:14:07
Hisham Alasad
There is a wire, a fiber cable wire connected to it. Just to go back to the the credibility and liability you talking about back in the days they want to keep it that way. Yeah.

00:15:14:10 - 00:15:36:04
Ian Bergman
Well you're right and it's okay. Okay. So speaking of innovation, I mean boy dual use in defense tech and seems to be a topic everybody's okay with these days, which is a change. But yeah, like isn't that wild right. Drone and drone warfare is a thing. It is here to stay. Yeah. And now they're tethered across kilometers.

00:15:36:04 - 00:15:41:18
Ian Bergman
They're tethered by by fiber optic cables. Have you seen the photos of the have you seen the photos have kind of.

00:15:41:21 - 00:16:04:08
Hisham Alasad
Seen a field? I could not believe it, but see, like how innovation can be so simple sometimes. So yeah, if you gotta want to call it a wireless, a drone that could be jammed controlled, all of that just could get rid of where the wireless go back to the wire. As simple as that. They chucked a wire in it and it's just keep going.

00:16:04:10 - 00:16:39:03
Ian Bergman
Yeah. It's crazy. It's absolutely crazy. Well, okay, let's talk about some of the innovations, that you've been involved with because honestly, it's been so much. But, you know, we met in Doha, you have an incredible role with, with Qatar Airways. And, you know, maybe we'll talk about that a little bit later. But you have such a cool career and you actually come out of the banking sector and, you know, we had a little bit of a conversation before we got started about innovation and finance in the banking center and how it is not necessarily equally distributed around the world.

00:16:39:05 - 00:17:00:18
Ian Bergman
And I guess I'm going to be honest, innovation is not always, good in the banking sector since, the banking sector, it's probably caused a few economic disasters in its day. But that such as it is, I would love to hear a little bit of your story. Right. How did you come to this world that we call innovation?

00:17:00:20 - 00:17:10:26
Ian Bergman
And what has that meant to you, particularly in terms of opportunities that you've seen in banking, financial services, etc.?

00:17:10:28 - 00:17:15:01
Hisham Alasad
That's a very deep question. Well, I'll try my.

00:17:15:03 - 00:17:15:27
Ian Bergman
Deepest for us.

00:17:15:27 - 00:17:50:19
Hisham Alasad
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll try to answer. Look, again, it all started from the mindset. I see things from like a human race lens. Okay. As I said at the beginning, I'm a big believer that innovation should serve people first. And that's by connecting communities, reducing barriers and unlocking opportunities. I started about like 20 years ago in the street intersections of, digital transformations and, you know, and then evolved into the concept of innovation, with a Palestinian background.

00:17:50:21 - 00:18:18:02
Hisham Alasad
I'm from New Zealand, you know, the land of the long white cloud. And then recently, 4 or 5 months ago, I moved to Qatar, because the innovation was attractive. People ask me, actually, why did you move to Qatar? I have my own personal reason and professional reasons. They stuck with the personal ones. I'm always conscious of stagnation in.

00:18:18:04 - 00:18:49:13
Hisham Alasad
It's easy. It's easy to get into that trap, as a technologist without noticing. Especially when you are deep in your comfort zone. I've been in the financial services doing innovation for the UI, and yes, I've got my hands on the shiny tools. I know what's happening and all of that, but you reach the point, you know, the ins and outs, you even to the point where you expect you able to predict what happens next, what people will think, etc., etc. and that's what you need to give yourself a kick or a nudge.

00:18:49:15 - 00:18:59:22
Hisham Alasad
And that's where you need to give yourself the challenge. For me, innovation is overcoming fear. That's my definition of motivation, by the way.

00:18:59:28 - 00:19:01:09
Ian Bergman
We're going to talk about that later.

00:19:01:09 - 00:19:24:09
Hisham Alasad
I'll leave very simple, very simple motivation, fear. And what could be more unsettling than changing country, culture industry and go to a country you know, no one in it just because you're attracted to innovation. They do it. That innovation frontier is shifting around the world and now the momentum is building in the GCC. And I would love to be part of it.

00:19:24:15 - 00:19:25:08
Hisham Alasad
As simple as that.

00:19:25:15 - 00:19:50:23
Ian Bergman
Well, and it's as simple as that. But it's important. And so, you know, let's talk a little bit about some of the innovation that you've been involved with in the past. And so for instance, you're a really big advocate of open banking. Open banking is certainly a form of both technical but also procedural and regulatory innovation. You know, tell me a bit about that.

00:19:50:23 - 00:19:54:03
Ian Bergman
Why is it important? And what does it mean to you?

00:19:54:06 - 00:19:58:09
Hisham Alasad
I'm not only a fan of open banking. I did my doctorate in open banking as well.

00:19:58:11 - 00:20:04:24
Ian Bergman
Just so I've had a thought. Leader is the state of the art. So you should be able to answer this question.

00:20:04:24 - 00:20:24:28
Hisham Alasad
All right. Just to add to it. So, as you know, I wear two hats as a professional and as a academic as well. So what's happening with it? Let me just give you a background about open banking, where this all started. They did some review, in the UK, EU, of what's happening in the traditional open, banking industry.

00:20:24:28 - 00:20:56:01
Hisham Alasad
And they found that it lacks competition. Surprise, surprise and innovation. So they did they decided, you know what we're going to do some, they call it, regulatory intervention to force banks to do something about it. And that what they did, they said, banks now we need to shift the power, to the customer's hand. We need to give the customers the ability to decide to share their financial data with other competitors, whether they are banks or other players.

00:20:56:01 - 00:21:19:08
Hisham Alasad
I equals fintechs, the small players before that, while you actually own the data. But the banks, they make it so difficult for you to grab that data. You need to go to the bank. You need to ask for a paper copy stamped, notarized, certified. If you apply for any other bank, good luck. Even though it's a nightmare, it is a nightmare.

00:21:19:10 - 00:21:36:12
Hisham Alasad
I read somewhere, It's funny. The probability of you going into many marriages, breaking up your marriage, and going to multiple relationships. It's higher than breaking up with your first bank.

00:21:36:14 - 00:21:50:05
Ian Bergman
Because just that's incredible. Because of the lock in. Basically because of the the friction and the difficulty of moving systems. Is that true globally? Does that vary by kind of region, by country?

00:21:50:12 - 00:22:18:04
Hisham Alasad
It's everywhere. It's everywhere. They make it the way they designed it that way. So they came with open banking and they said, banks, you supposed to be able to exchange data with other banks and, and entities, using standardized APIs. The objective is to improve competition and entice innovations. So what does that mean in my definition? That will change change the contact and the behavior of the banking industry, the traditional banking industry.

00:22:18:07 - 00:22:38:08
Hisham Alasad
Suddenly the banks has to face the fact they do not own the data anymore. They have to face the fact that Ian and his sham have the power to say, send my data to that fintech, to that startup. I want to work with them. So yeah, retention rate not guaranteed anymore. The concept of that sham fake loyalty towards original banks.

00:22:38:09 - 00:23:02:22
Hisham Alasad
It's not there anymore. That relationship between 1 to 1 relationship. That means your relationship to one bank changed to one to many, because you know you have a relationship with many banks. And when many fintechs that fundamentally changed or will change the traditional banking, industry. And I examined all of that in my, research.

00:23:02:24 - 00:23:08:04
Ian Bergman
Well, and what's the what what was the core, thesis, of your I.

00:23:08:04 - 00:23:29:10
Hisham Alasad
Examined the impact of open banking and the social constructions of the banking industry. What does that mean? How the relationship between customer and bank changed from transactional and to social and how banks reacted or would react to open banking. That will change your position. Some banks will decide, you know, just going to do the wait and see.

00:23:29:12 - 00:23:50:21
Hisham Alasad
Do not say that's a failure. That's a death recipe. Basically, some banks will say, you know what I was just going to be I will accept that I do not have development capability. So I would rely on the fintechs to come with all awesome capabilities. And I will turn into a distributor. Yeah. So I will take all these capabilities from fintechs and become a distributor to my customers.

00:23:50:28 - 00:24:14:02
Hisham Alasad
Other banks will say, no, no, no, I will focus on development, I will do the capabilities, but I will rely on the fintechs for the distributions. They become manufacturers in a very advanced form. Banks. Some banks will say they will strip to their bare bones. They will say, I will only offer Declan. No, your customers and the anti-money laundering, anti-terrorism kind of, regulations with the banking license.

00:24:14:04 - 00:24:26:03
Hisham Alasad
And I will turn it into platform marketplace where all fintechs will come saying, I'm a distributor, I have the capability and I will just clip the ticket. That's a video platform, but that's where we're headed at some stage.

00:24:26:05 - 00:24:53:10
Ian Bergman
Well, to, you know, and to your point, it's really interesting to sort of bucket banks into or any organization right into the risk resistance. The people that embrace, etc.. But, I mean, you know, there's an entire generation that I think grew up certainly in the US where I grew up, I'm less familiar with the rest of the world, but there's an entire generation that grew up with tools that were deliberately trying to push against this concept of open banking, right?

00:24:53:10 - 00:25:20:12
Ian Bergman
Like mint, plaid. Right. I remember I know the I mean, I have actually, I think, I think 20 years ago or something, when I first use mint that I'm dating myself, I can't remember how long ago it was, but like, it was a little revelatory, right? All of a sudden there was a product that in one place could just show me all of my accounts, which is so simple and yet so important and so hard to do.

00:25:20:12 - 00:25:54:14
Ian Bergman
And then, to the best of my knowledge, plaid has been fighting the good fight with limited success, some success, but limited success to try. And you know, enable consumers to, interop across financial services for some time. And yet, despite having grown up with the obvious availability of these concepts and technologies, it is still incredibly hard to get my account at my primary bank to talk to my primary brokerage.

00:25:54:17 - 00:26:07:22
Hisham Alasad
And this is why the, regulator intervention is very important. Unfortunately, the banks are not coming to play. Correct. So they need to be forced. And this is why the open banking regulations. So but.

00:26:07:22 - 00:26:15:19
Ian Bergman
Okay. But do they help. Let me ask like do our regulatory or regulators potentially proponents or regulators part of the problem.

00:26:15:21 - 00:26:35:25
Hisham Alasad
Well it depends which country, which region I can't speak for example, for New Zealand and Australia they are actually they they look at it holistically. I like their approach. They said we're going to introduce legislation called Customer Data Rights Cd-R and we're going to go industrial by industry. They started with the banking and then they can go to telco and then utility and energy.

00:26:35:28 - 00:26:58:04
Hisham Alasad
And they say with the banking. Yeah with the banking. They say banks you need to release two kind of information, the account information and the payment initiation. And for that they there is two API standardized APIs banks have to adhere to. Correct. So suddenly Hassan is able to have I have, let's say like there are five, six banks over there in New Zealand or Australia.

00:26:58:04 - 00:27:18:06
Hisham Alasad
And so the one bank I use it to pay my power, the other one, the other one to get paid, the other one I pay my kids. And all of this is complex complexity. So the new there is, there is a fintech that comes saying, hey, just authorize me to to extract your data and I will tell you exactly you and then, your balance sheet or what's happening with spendings.

00:27:18:11 - 00:27:38:05
Hisham Alasad
I actually I will go do payments on your behalf and not only that, I will help you to budget for your plans, your goals. Like there is an app called plum in the UK that is that amazingly, and not only that, all of that, all of that in the pocket of the financial well-being. Yeah, all of that in something called, PFM Personal Financial Management.

00:27:38:07 - 00:27:56:09
Hisham Alasad
And this is why I told you. I told you earlier that innovation, the proper innovation, in my view, should be human centric. Does it add value to humans? So when we built this budgeting tool or fintech, is it to sell the product or actually to help our customers to have a better financial will be and get them out of the hole?

00:27:56:12 - 00:28:01:17
Hisham Alasad
This is the idea and this is what innovation actually delivers its purpose.

00:28:01:19 - 00:28:26:28
Ian Bergman
Well, okay. And in interestingly, it is being, driven by a very sort of consumer and I would say citizen centric like that, I guess is ideally the role of government services, citizen centric view of what should be possible, is where did the problem where where did the problem statement come from? Is this coming from consumer complaints about friction?

00:28:26:28 - 00:28:35:16
Ian Bergman
Is it coming from an independent party or academic research saying, wait, this is crazy. Like where is the catalyst for open banking coming from?

00:28:35:19 - 00:28:58:04
Hisham Alasad
It came from a review. There is something called payment directive. Review piece de one and P is due to that in Europe EU they did a review and they found that this is not good. It's completely monopolistic industry. They are five point players in each country. And you know what I will hold the branch of my customer base.

00:28:58:04 - 00:29:28:24
Hisham Alasad
And as I said nobody leaves because they made even switching between banks is so complex and there is no innovation. High prices, high fees, lack of processing of products and services. They only see mortgages and credit cards. There is nothing. So if you want to democratize the accessibility of data and if you want to have financial inclusion, because not everyone can have a bank account or have a them that the talent to manage your bank account.

00:29:29:01 - 00:29:43:26
Hisham Alasad
We need this fintech to make it simple for them. And in order for the fintech to work, they they said guess what, I have the technology. I'm startup, I'm agile, I can do things, I've got slick UX, but I need the data and only then, you know. Yeah.

00:29:44:03 - 00:30:10:28
Ian Bergman
One one of the things that you and I have talked about in the past is that real solutions and innovation often come when the gap between what people know should be possible and the service they actually get becomes untenable. Right? It just becomes so huge that people get really frustrated. And as you're talking, I'm thinking about the fact that as a company, my company Alchemist, you know, we have banks in multiple countries.

00:30:11:01 - 00:30:46:06
Ian Bergman
We have to physically have somebody fly to one of those countries. I'm not going to name the country to do major banking transactions, which is insane. It is insane to have to be physically present, walk into a branch with a stamp, which, by the way, is something that we didn't wasn't even a concept to do work. And you look at that, you're like in today's world where I can seamlessly, you know, and with high confidence, move money around in crypto, communicate on zoom, do whatever it seems crazy.

00:30:46:08 - 00:31:01:11
Ian Bergman
And so it is interesting because I do feel like maybe we should be at a tipping point. But the question is how do you break the logjam? Right? Can the regulators actually do it? Does one country break and then open it up for everyone else? Does this have to be done region by region?

00:31:01:14 - 00:31:07:08
Hisham Alasad
First of all, I understand it is insane, but unfortunately it's reality what you just described. I have a it.

00:31:07:08 - 00:31:08:21
Ian Bergman
Is it is the reality.

00:31:08:24 - 00:31:30:04
Hisham Alasad
Have a good news and bad news. Let me start with the good news. Open banking. Now you look at it saying, just opening the data silos between your information can be exchanged with other banks. So fintechs within the banking system, right. That's called open banking. Using standardized APIs, this concept will evolve to become open finance. So what does that mean?

00:31:30:04 - 00:31:51:26
Hisham Alasad
You will this API standard as APIs will be shared with other financial institutions, superannuation, insurance and things. So suddenly. And you will be using a fintech. And they tell you, hey, you're paying too much for your insurance. Why are you even with that provider? Go with the other provider because you have the AI and the power to analyze you the way you're spending that your things give you.

00:31:52:03 - 00:32:00:06
Hisham Alasad
Suddenly you have access to more affordable, cheaper products and services. Competitive. This is the the promise behind the open banking.

00:32:00:09 - 00:32:06:22
Ian Bergman
Is this happening anywhere in the world right now? I mean, you mentioned sort of the ANZ region. Is there anywhere else that sort of a leader.

00:32:06:27 - 00:32:31:00
Hisham Alasad
Is happening in the ANZ region in a small scale? It's happening in Scandinavian countries, the Sweden, Denmark and Finland. Yeah. This is not it's not Scandinavian, but in Finland and Norway they are so advanced in that text. But in order to have open banking up and running or open finance, you need the government intervention in terms of regulation, and you need to have a concept called digital identity.

00:32:31:03 - 00:32:46:21
Hisham Alasad
Yeah. So if you do not have a digital identifier, that would work as this is me. So all banks know who you are and what do you that will actually authenticate that it is you in his hands trying to present it to you? It's not gonna work. And that's where the challenges.

00:32:46:24 - 00:33:20:14
Ian Bergman
Well, and interestingly, I mean, that's actually really fascinating because maybe more so than most other sectors, it does seem that sort of finance and banking probably intersects with government digital identity requirements, things like health security, you name it. So, you know, there are countries in the world that have very strong governmental frameworks for digital identities. Interestingly, I didn't hear like the one I think of is Estonia, but I know there's quite a few, I think Lithuania, I think actually all the Baltics are doing this.

00:33:20:16 - 00:33:28:14
Hisham Alasad
I'll tell you something, like a New Zealand, for example, we do not have a digital, we don't have an I.D., we do not have a national I.D.. I'm not sure if this this. You guys have this idea?

00:33:28:16 - 00:33:30:13
Ian Bergman
No, we don't actually. Yeah. So we.

00:33:30:16 - 00:33:31:04
Hisham Alasad
Had the license.

00:33:31:04 - 00:33:31:28
Ian Bergman
For 30 years.

00:33:32:00 - 00:33:59:06
Hisham Alasad
Driver's license and passports. That's all we have. Yeah, yeah, but when I came to the SEC, to Qatar, I've been given, a card with a national ID. And this national I.D. number is called ID number. It actually identifies you everywhere. It's even. Yeah. And you drive a license in Scandinavian countries. In Sweden, for example, they have something called piso number, which means personal number and is something of the second you're born.

00:33:59:08 - 00:34:19:27
Hisham Alasad
The tax department will issue with this number and stays with you until departure. That's it. It's used everywhere at the clinic, at the doctor, the hospital, at the airport, at the financials, at the banks. They know everything about you. But this is you identify it. You need that thing in order to enable all this, ecosystem of data exchange.

00:34:19:29 - 00:34:34:23
Ian Bergman
So. So there's some prerequisites, but they're starting to, they're starting to come into play. So are you are you optimistic, are you optimistic that a world of not just open banking, but open finance is possible? Probable?

00:34:34:25 - 00:34:55:10
Hisham Alasad
It is probable, but I think unfortunate that it will take some time. I'll tell you what. In a in a talk three years ago, maybe three years ago, I've given, I said there is something, a concept called, in my opinion, the Holy Trinity. And that's the open banking and open data. I meant the exchange of data and ecosystems.

00:34:55:13 - 00:35:20:18
Hisham Alasad
Why the international and global ecosystems, the AI and the quantum computing. So in order to have amazing offering products and services for the consumer, for the human, I can think about the human centric technologies. That's what I'm advocate for, right? You need to have this, the, the capability that I buy. I need a power compute power behind it.

00:35:20:20 - 00:35:45:15
Hisham Alasad
You need a quantum computing. So when these three technologies mature or intersect at some stage, which, I said three years ago about 80s. So, look at about 2030, then you will have some amazing thing because you would have the data floating around, text that open, that can open, that can open finance, open data for enforce. You would have the AI capability maturing and able to do this deep, deep analysis.

00:35:45:19 - 00:35:55:14
Hisham Alasad
And you have the compute compute power behind it. Put them together. That's where the human race will go into another leap in our, future.

00:35:55:16 - 00:36:04:00
Ian Bergman
Okay. Well I'm excited. So we've now made two predictions. And so so we got 2035. Now we have a 2030 time. It is.

00:36:04:06 - 00:36:05:25
Hisham Alasad
Yeah. It is, it's amazing.

00:36:06:01 - 00:36:27:17
Ian Bergman
Yeah, yeah, I obviously, but I love this. So I want to I want to step back because we're talking about innovation change you know, new capability. And yeah. And actually kind of a hard, tightly regulated area but important that something that touches all of us. I want to step back for a second and talk about innovation all up.

00:36:27:19 - 00:36:44:22
Ian Bergman
And you talked about it is overcoming fear. You use those words, which is really fascinating. So tell me again what that means. And then I want to talk about this, framework you've been noodling on the responsible innovation framework. But what does it mean to like, why is innovation overcoming fear?

00:36:44:24 - 00:37:00:19
Hisham Alasad
Think about it in if you want. If you want to just if you trying to do things where everyone does things you're not, you're not going to get any unique or something out of the box kind of results and outcomes. Right. Totally unique. Right.

00:37:00:20 - 00:37:02:28
Ian Bergman
To do the same thing, get the same output.

00:37:02:29 - 00:37:23:22
Hisham Alasad
You need to push the boundaries. You need to push the envelope. But guess what? At the boundaries and things, this is where it's scary, right? It's subject to failure. The brand you've been branded as a failure is subject to, depletion of budget and investment and not having the traditional return on investment. How dare you? Asking for money and you're not going to give me money back?

00:37:23:22 - 00:37:44:27
Hisham Alasad
What does that even mean? There is the think of, people pushing back resistance as well. So all these things make people always fear, you know what? I'm not going to do that. Yeah. So so you need to overcome that fear to push the envelope to do that. Think of them in order to, re scratch the surface of innovation.

00:37:45:00 - 00:37:46:16
Hisham Alasad
This is my thought process.

00:37:46:18 - 00:38:11:07
Ian Bergman
You know what? It makes sense. And I think it ties into a lot of kind of, the theory and the, research and the literature on risk taking and all that. But it's hard, right? Like you're really asking people to push through fear that fear is there for a reason, right? The fear is there because things can go horribly wrong.

00:38:11:10 - 00:38:23:07
Ian Bergman
How do you think about guiding innovators through, you know, not maybe. Maybe not just embracing the fear, but managing the idea that things can go wrong.

00:38:23:10 - 00:38:29:15
Hisham Alasad
I have a couple of things to say on that. First of all, I want to have a chat with them.

00:38:29:18 - 00:38:54:09
Hisham Alasad
With a colleague of mine, and he was saying that any ideas should be grounded with realism. And my answer to him was to them was, this is why you don't have the innovation mindset, because we need to conservation. It's three things, right? It's a philosophy. You should have that philosophy running across the organization. I'm talking about, like corporate innovation, kind of yeah.

00:38:54:12 - 00:39:17:22
Hisham Alasad
Philosophy. You need to have a mindset. And not everyone have this mindset. Not everyone, you know people because this is fear. But they will they will camouflage. It was, regulations. They camouflage it with risk. They camouflage it with. Yep. You know what I mean? But it is fear to push the boundaries. And it is practice. So in order to do innovation you need to have the philosophy running.

00:39:17:22 - 00:39:36:04
Hisham Alasad
You need to have the mindset, the growth mindset, the, you know, the curious mindset and all of that and practice and for that practice, I was thinking, actually, what I want, I want to shout out to, to to my workmates and colleagues to hydrolyze. And Maggie, we took them discussing a concept called responsible innovation.

00:39:36:07 - 00:39:37:05
Ian Bergman
Yes. Tell me.

00:39:37:11 - 00:40:09:03
Hisham Alasad
Inspired by the, you know, the responsible AI framework that everyone is talking about, everyone is discussing, and we understand there was, McKinsey published a recent paper about how even, adopted AI with responsible, responsible AI adoption is actually increases the return on investment. Right. So I was thinking, why don't we think about, introducing the responsible innovation framework right now, innovation is moving faster than governance.

00:40:09:05 - 00:40:11:00
Hisham Alasad
Faster. Does society correct.

00:40:11:04 - 00:40:13:11
Ian Bergman
By by like an order of magnitude.

00:40:13:14 - 00:40:38:08
Hisham Alasad
Great and even faster than the people's ability to trust it. So look at the AI. It takes massively. It there is abundance of capabilities of AI every day, but very limited guardrails. So I thought we thought, why don't we apply the logic of responsible AI to innovation itself? Does it make sense? It might. I mean, it makes.

00:40:38:08 - 00:40:44:03
Ian Bergman
Sense, but how do we how do we do it? What? Tell me, what does that framework look like? How do we put it into practice?

00:40:44:05 - 00:41:14:01
Hisham Alasad
For me, responsible innovation means, creating innovation that it is scalable, ethical, inclusive and beneficial to society, not only to that balance sheet. Yeah. So what we need to do in order to do that, we need to think about a few things. We need to have what I call the purpose alignment. We need to align the business objectives, organization objectives with the human okay.

00:41:14:03 - 00:41:38:21
Hisham Alasad
We need to purpose alignment. Yeah. Yeah. You mean outcomes like we need to know ask questions. Who would benefit from that and who's left behind? We need to start thinking about them. Yeah we need when would that would that would the responsible innovation. We need to think about the open innovation ecosystem okay. The close innovation. You cannot do it.

00:41:38:21 - 00:41:49:17
Hisham Alasad
As simple as that. You need to have the partnerships. You need the open APIs. You need the open data. You need the partnership with the startups, with the research institutes, with the educational institutions.

00:41:49:17 - 00:41:56:20
Ian Bergman
You need the you need the recognition that no matter how many resources you have, you have a fraction of the resources available in the world.

00:41:56:24 - 00:42:17:28
Hisham Alasad
Absolutely. Because working with universities will give you the fresh thinking. For example, working with the startups will give you the speed, etc., etc. and then the things that people always coming to critique, innovation, innovation about, they say, you guys destroy us. No, no, we're not destroys. We're disruptors. And I believe that innovation without governance is actually is very chaotic.

00:42:18:03 - 00:42:43:07
Hisham Alasad
Right. Yeah. So we need to wait and and think about when we need to learn about all this. Some responsible AI teams, we learned we learned about the bias. Right. We need to be sure that any other innovation is not biased. We need to think about that. What is the drift? You know, the drift monitoring in AI as well, when the outcomes start drifting from the way we think and then we recalibrate again, we need to think about that.

00:42:43:09 - 00:43:06:29
Hisham Alasad
Because if we start going to innovations and it is biased against ethnic group or specific group, this is not a good innovation. We need to start thinking about what about the return on investment. We need to add a component to it. The total return on investment will be the traditional return on investment, plus our ESG component. Yeah, we want to see who is benefiting from all of that.

00:43:07:05 - 00:43:29:15
Hisham Alasad
Yeah. Look, look, look at the open banking for example. It allows for financial inclusion. I left a lot of in bank communities to take the first step towards financial identity. Yeah. Yep. And and we need to think about scalability because any innovation that's not scalable it's just theater as simple as that. And I do not have to. Yeah.

00:43:29:17 - 00:43:41:01
Hisham Alasad
So we with we've been trying to develop this ideas about responsible innovation from work to help industries to innovate with purpose, but at the same time not being reckless.

00:43:41:03 - 00:44:04:07
Ian Bergman
Well, I, I love this. And so let me let me recap because I think this is actually really interesting. Right. So responsible innovation framework needs to take into consideration purpose alignment aligning objectives with human outcomes. The notion of an open ecosystem. Because you're just not going to make progress when you're closed. You know governance right for and you you talked about a bunch of bias drift.

00:44:04:07 - 00:44:23:00
Ian Bergman
Yeah yeah, yeah bias drift etc.. And then two types of ROI. Right. And a question about scalability. And I don't know how to put that in the framework, but you sort of stated this notion that innovation that isn't scalable is just theater, which is a great soundbite. By the way, I and I agree with it. So thank you.

00:44:23:00 - 00:44:47:02
Ian Bergman
So this framework for, for for corporate innovators who follow this framework, who, you know, are deliberate about documenting purpose, alignment, who are deliberate about reaching out to the open ecosystem, who are deliberate about setting up effective, governance, right, not just for bias and drift monitoring, but for, understanding the disruption, etc., etc.. What about what can they expect, like what will change in their life?

00:44:47:02 - 00:44:48:10
Ian Bergman
If they follow this framework?

00:44:48:11 - 00:45:05:05
Hisham Alasad
What will change? They will start delivering values to our to our human race. What was will meant? Who will be able to deliver something to create a life to our people that will serve for generations to come?

00:45:05:07 - 00:45:10:09
Ian Bergman
I'm taking notes, by the way. I don't know if you see it on the video. I'm like, I'm going to say I like this.

00:45:10:15 - 00:45:36:07
Hisham Alasad
But honestly, because again, if the more I understand technology, then the more I understand it should be human centric. It should save us all, us globally, all communities in, in the in Africa and Asia and Europe and America anywhere. It's not for a country or for a region. Not at all. So when we talk about innovation and innovation allows you to take this frog leaping into the future, look what's happening in this UCC.

00:45:36:09 - 00:45:50:06
Hisham Alasad
It's just amazing what I'm seeing. But we need that responsible innovation similar to responsible AI. Go hand by hand to ensure that we are serving the purpose, which is a human centric technology.

00:45:50:08 - 00:46:15:24
Ian Bergman
Incredible. Well, I appreciate you. And I appreciate, the, impact that you can have in your new role, both with Qatar Airways, but also your role that has been evolving your entire career as a as a thought leader in advancing the state of the art and, think how we think about innovation. You've given me a lot to think about.

00:46:15:27 - 00:46:49:09
Ian Bergman
And I'm busy taking notes on on frameworks and bullet points and ideas. But I think you've also, you know, you've teed up this concept that is near and dear to my heart, right? Which is that there is inevitability to, you know, things that are happening in the world, whether it is the way in which we will get to interacting with data, whether it is the way in which new technological tools will support us, etc., and when you embrace that inevitability and then you know, stop, pause or a little bit thoughtful about how you respond to it, you can actually drive real change in the world.

00:46:49:09 - 00:47:11:15
Ian Bergman
And I think that's super, super cool. Let me ask you, as we sort of close because we're we're a little over time here. I thank you for your, your time tonight. You know what is next for you in innovation? Do you have, you know, some big hairy goals ahead of you that you're going to use to measure your success over the coming years?

00:47:11:18 - 00:47:31:04
Hisham Alasad
That's a very good question. So, I just can I just talk about a point that, crossed my mind as well? What you just we talking about the aviation and the financial services and all of that? You know, the similarities. They are completely different industries, but yet very close, if you think about it. Just it's just mind blowing.

00:47:31:04 - 00:47:53:01
Hisham Alasad
Just. I was having this thinking that both these industries are customers are customer driven, these customer obsession. And both of them correct. Like we as a human. Yes. I mean, what is the two most valuable things currently? We have our lives, our souls and our money. Correct. So when we go to a bank, we trust a bank with our money.

00:47:53:03 - 00:48:17:11
Hisham Alasad
That's a deep level of trust. And we go to airlines. We trust them with our life. People on this mechanical things and flowing from place to place. That's a deep trust. So this trust, deep rooted customer obsession, industrials. So my, my my next I think I would love to, be the showrunner of different industries at some stage.

00:48:17:11 - 00:48:35:08
Hisham Alasad
Again. But as we evolve them, we have more open data flowing globally, internationally between us. I think industries we start thinking and the, the aviation, we start talking with the financial services, we start talking with education, with all of that. And I would love to be a contributor to that thing.

00:48:35:11 - 00:48:54:27
Ian Bergman
Amazing. And I'm sure it's I mean, I'm sure it is inevitable that there will be material contributions to this change. And so for folks who are listening to the pod and want to follow your journey, want to stay in touch, what's the best way for them to do that? Are you on LinkedIn? Do you publish where where should folks go to, to follow your work?

00:48:54:28 - 00:49:18:06
Hisham Alasad
I am on LinkedIn. I do publish from some to sometime, sometime to time. You can't find me. Just talk to me, stop me and just ask me questions. I love having coffees with random people. I do that, and I do have another vision, by the way, and you'll be surprised it's somehow politically driven. I know you don't.

00:49:18:06 - 00:49:20:23
Hisham Alasad
I like to talk politics on your podcast, but I just again.

00:49:21:00 - 00:49:34:02
Ian Bergman
Oh, let's do it. No, I, I by the way, my degree is in politics, so, I'm willing to dig in. Let's go. No, tell me you've got I think you do have, a really interesting vision. I think I know.

00:49:34:03 - 00:49:58:16
Hisham Alasad
I do, I do, I do this and this is a driven from, like most all my life in New Zealand. But I do have, as I said, a Palestinian background. So I see myself just the way I see myself. I'm British between East and West. I do have the, the advantage of understanding the, the, the eastern mind and the Western mind and how things work out the Middle East.

00:49:58:18 - 00:50:21:15
Hisham Alasad
It's been like a war torn region for years and years and years. Yes. And if you just try to narrow down a little bit, there is this tiny area. It's in the Golan Heights. It's between Syria, Lebanon, Palestine, Israel and Jordan. And this is like the center of tension of a lot of things. Like as we speak yesterday, there was some escalation over there.

00:50:21:18 - 00:50:53:16
Hisham Alasad
My dream to tend to run a project or a vision or a program, call it I for peace. I want to change that, that region, that area, and the Silicon Valley of the Middle East. I want to bring all this pink up. Big companies, tech companies to establish their to just start building technologies, give hope to the region, give hope to the people over there.

00:50:53:19 - 00:50:55:21
Hisham Alasad
The people are so smart in the region.

00:50:55:24 - 00:51:09:15
Ian Bergman
And provide a vision of what sort of hospital they are. Yeah, I buy that in a heartbeat. I work with unbelievably talented engineers, business people from from every one of those countries that you just named.

00:51:09:18 - 00:51:19:01
Hisham Alasad
So if anybody out there listening and interested to have AI for peace to solve the peace process in the Middle East, I do have some plans. Reach out to me. I will talk to you.

00:51:19:03 - 00:51:53:18
Ian Bergman
Let's let's make that the rallying call of this podcast. It's I'm. I really appreciate you coming on because, you know, I think you have a, in a sort of an acute view of what can be possible in the world, but also some really big aspirations. And so, you know, you are proposing innovation. You are proposing positive change that brings vision to a region that, you know, takes advantage of the both technological and societal changes that are going on around us and provides a bit of a rallying cry for people who want peace.

00:51:53:18 - 00:52:09:02
Ian Bergman
So let's do it. I I'm on board. Get in touch with doctor al-Assad. Anybody who wants to talk about this and with that doctor, Hisham al-Assad. Thank you so much for joining us on Innovators Inside. This has been an absolute pleasure and I can't wait to do it again.

00:52:09:04 - 00:52:31:06
Hisham Alasad
Thank you very much. And for having me. Analysts always keep in mind that innovation is not about speed, it's about direction. And if we innovate responsibly and with a human mind, with a human in mind, we can build a future where people want to live. And that is the mission. Just keep that in mind. Thank you very much.

00:52:31:06 - 00:52:31:23
Hisham Alasad
Yeah.

00:52:31:25 - 00:52:34:28
Ian Bergman
Words well spoken. Thank you so much.